George Will had an interesting column in
The Washington Post last week entitled
Time for Bush to See The Realities of Iraq. It starts out criticizing some half baked notion coming out of President Bush's mouth (not that
I am surprised by such a thought) about how people who think we can't be successful in Iraq are racist or some such thing. President Bush ended up being a little racist himself in the process of making the statement (again, not much of a surprise). Will ends that part of the column with this quote, which describes how I feel about the Bush Administration quite plainly:
This administration cannot be trusted to govern if it cannot be counted on to think and, having thought, to have second thoughts.
However, that was not really the main thrust of Will's column. I thought this section, in particular, fits in to Bob's "Nation Growing" vs. "Nation Building" theme:
Speaking of culture, as neoconservative nation-builders would be well-advised to avoid doing, Pat Moynihan said: "The central conservative truth is that it is culture, not politics, that determines the success of a society. The central liberal truth is that politics can change a culture and save it from itself." Here we reach the real issue about Iraq, as distinct from unpleasant musings about who believes what about skin color.
The issue is the second half of Moynihan's formulation -- our ability to wield political power to produce the requisite cultural change in a place such as Iraq. Time was, this question would have separated conservatives from liberals. Nowadays it separates conservatives from neoconservatives.
Condoleezza Rice, a political scientist, believes there is scholarly evidence that democratic institutions do not merely spring from a hospitable culture, but that they also can help create such a culture. She is correct; they can. They did so in the young American republic. But it would be reassuring to see more evidence that the administration is being empirical, believing that this can happen in some places, as opposed to ideological, believing that it must happen everywhere it is tried.
I think this is a very astute observation. Imagine the "young American Republic" being handed our Constitution from the French, for example - it wouldn't have been as good.
I highly recommend the Will piece. And he is a conservative! Maybe it will help some Republicans realize some of the horrors of the thinking - or lack thereof - of the current Administration.
Bob's response: Woa. How cool is that to click onto Coffee With Rhoads and see George Will's picture?! I hope Rhoads passed that by the lawyers.
I'm not really comepetent to judge the relative roles or the importance of culture versus politics in the emergence of democracy in Iraq or anywhere else. But I'll offer an opinion. I think that prosperous, free, and peaceful nations living under self-rule are the result of a respect for property and the rights of fellow citizens, not a cause of such things. I think democracy leads to majoritarianism without the underlying respect for rights. Tyranny by the majority is scarcely better than tyranny by a dictator. But perhaps as George Will suggests, political reform along the lines of democracy can lead to the sorts of values that I think must precede democratic self-rule. I haven't studied the issue as much as Will, Moynihan, and Rice have.
In general I think governments do more harm than good when it comes to the development and progress of free societies. Getting tyranical leaders off the backs of the locals as we did in Iraq is a worthy goal, but we shouldn't expect broad short-term successes with such a policy. Nor should we expect much support for such a policy in the UN or in the world at large. Despots who grow rich impoverishing their subjects don't look kindly on policies designed to oust them. The UN is full of such despots.
I have no confidence that a Kerry Administration would be an improvement over the Bush Administration when it comes to Iraq, the war on terror, or foreign policy in general. But whichever party wins the White House in November, I think we should all be skeptical of claims to an easy solution to any of these problems. For all his faults, Bush did say that the war on terror would be a very long one. He got that right. People getting caught up in the goings on in Iraq today should not forget that.
Rhoads' response to Bob's response
Nope. No lawyers. It's just a link - not sure why it would be any different than any other link.
The problem I have with your final paragraph, Bob, is that I have seen no credible evidence that the military action being taken by the Coalition in Iraq has anything to do with a War on Terrorism. That's my issue. Was Saddam a terrorist against his own people - absolutely. A threat to the rest of the world - not that I have seen.
Bob's subsequent response:
Iraq and terrorism. Debate the wisdom of invading Iraq all you want, but take off the blinders regarding the links between Saddam and terrorism.
Bob UPDATE:
Here Daniel Byman from the liberal Brookings Institution argued that invading Iraq would increase our risks of terrorist attacks. He discusses Iraq's links to terrorism.
Rhoads: Still not convinced. At least not relatively speaking, compared to, say, Syria. And I wouldn't have wanted to attack them unprovoked either.
Bob again: No, big bad America shouldn't go around attacking, unprovoked, harmless little contries like Iraq. Oh, they did gas their own people during a war with neighboring Iran, they did invade Kuwait, launch SCUD missles at Israel, attempt to kill a former U.S. president, continue to shoot at our planes policing the no fly zone, force us to maintain a large standing army in Saudi Arabia, fail to comply with the terms of the cease fire that saved Saddam's butt in 1991, harbor and support terrorists of various stripes, pay families of Palestinian suicide bombers, and fail to cooperate with weapons inspectors over the last decade. But you're right, America should not go around attacking countries unprovoked.
Shame on George W. Bush. Shame on Bill Clinton for attacking Kosovo unprovoked. Shame on Bill Clinton for bombing Iraq and Sudan and Afhanistan, unprovoked. Wait I say. Wait until we get hit again. Disrupt al Qaeda, one blip on the world terror stage, by taking out the Taliban in Afghanistan and then wait for the next attack. We wouldn't want to attack anybody unprovoked. Nope the best policy is to let terrorists plan their attacks, arm themselves, and train in faraway lands. Let the intelligence community who told us there were WMD in Iraq catch 'em before they hit us again, of course it has to be JUST before (the threat must be imminent) or again we'd be hitting them unprovoked. Timing is crucial. Too early and we're bullies. Too late and we're dead. Your choice.
Unless we have the fingerprints on the bloody gun, the U.S. should just turtle. Pull in the old head and hope for the best. But don't go tryin' to build any missile defense system. That won't work. Clinton was nuts for funding such a thing. Nope. No forward defense. No missile defense. Just wait and hope. That's what third world terrorists respect. Weakness.
Hey, Jimmy Carter has eligibility left. You should go to the Democratic National Convention and start a Draft Carter movement. Bring back the late 1970s. You might carry DC with that message. Maybe.